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 The importance of "Soul Taker" and missing the timing.

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L.Lawliet
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PostSubject: The importance of "Soul Taker" and missing the timing.   Sun Jul 15, 2012 4:11 pm

Hello, so I've decided to make a new article given that not many people know the value of the card, so I guess I though that it would be good to show it. As the title says this one would be about "Soul Taker" and missing the timing.

Soul Taker, Type: Spell Card - Property: Normal
Code:
Destroy 1 face-up monster your opponent controls. Then, your opponent gains 1000 Life Points.

As you can see "Soul Taker" Normal Spell that destroys 1 face-up monster your opponent controls. Then, your opponent gains 1000 Life Points.
In other words you pick one of the troublesome monsters your opponent controls, destroy it and as you do that your opponent gains 1000 Life Points. Very simple.

The hidden ability of this card require one to understand the mechanics of cards that miss their timing. In this format there are 2 big and very used monsters that can "miss their timing" - "Lightpulsar Dragon" and "Elemental Hero The Shining". Yes they are 2 very nasty monsters, given that after they are destroyed the opponent can special summon a Level 5 or higher DARK Dragon-Type from their grave (Pulsar's effect) and pick 2 of their banished heroes and add them to their hand (Shining's effect), but did some of you know that both of their destruction effects are optional? They certainly sometimes might seem to be as if they are the mandatory like "Sangan" , but they both most definitely are not.
If either "Lightpulsar Dragon" or "Elemental Hero The Shining" are not the last thing on the chain link to be destroyed they may not trigger their destruction effects. Given that people understanding of how chain links work or specific cards such as "Soul Taker" or "Ryko, Lightsworn Hunter" or will be able to counteract these powerful effects.
For the example:
"If your opponent were to summon a copy of Elemental Hero The Shining while you had Mystical Space Typhoon and Torrential Tribute set you are in a position to not only destroy a backrow and The Shining, you can stop the opponent from returning two Elemental Heroes! If you were to activate Mystical Space Typhoon on a backrow and respond with Torrential Tribute the chain would resolve in such a manner that The Shining would be destroyed by Torrential Tribute but miss the opportunity to activate because Mystical Space Typhoon must resolve. The same would apply to Lightpulsar Dragon!"

About "Soul Taker" now - reading the text again "Destroy 1 face-up monster your opponent controls. Then, your opponent gains 1000 Life Points." The key word “then” signifies a disruption between the moment in which Soul Taker destroys the monster and the effect finishing resolving. That said given that the effects aren't mandatory they will miss their timing. The thing is to know that your card didn't resolve fully, therefor the optional effect monster like the 2 from before - "Lightpulsar Dragon" and "Elemental Hero The Shining" will miss their timing. The same thing will happen if you use a different card that has that "tricky" effect that can make optional effects miss their timing. Like: flip "Ryko, Lightsworn Hunter" and destroy the card, since "Ryko's" effect hasn't been fully resolved after it destroys the monster, it's optional effects miss their timing.

Now missing the timing is one thing. It's true that "Smashing Ground" sometimes do a better job, like say you have a "Thunder King Rai Oh" and "Smashing" in your hand - you're facing a 1 monster and a 1000LP left opponent. You hit "Smashing" you attack with "TK" and you win. But there is something else, now "Soul Taker" is not always the best choice in your deck/side deck, given (just for the example) you're playing Hieratics (TCG) OTK version, now the deck makes something like 8400 LP damage (again, this is TCG - not OCG), if you replace "Smashing Ground" with a "Soul Taker" you won't make the OTK, so my point is that I'm not saying that "Soul Taker" is always better than "Smashing Ground".
That said I'd replace "Smashing" with "Soul Taker" in the Hero match-up, in the Chaos Dragon match-up, even in the Dino Rabbit match-up, it just works better there. I've read countless of articles from YCS's how people just win cause of that one card - "Soul Taker". Like you're doing against a "Dolkka" with negation and a "Gorz" - you have "Dragonfly" + "sword" + "Hornet" and "Soul Taker". Now if that was a "Smashing Ground" you lose, you can't kill the 1700 DEF "Dolkka" meaning you can't use your effects, so you lose... But if you have "Soul Taker" you have the ability to target the monster, to choose for yourself. So you Choose "Dolkka" and kill your opponent with a OTK. So what is the other difference between the 2 cards - the ability to choose what card to destroy. As you see that's very important sometimes. The possibilities just seem endless with this card!

Well with that's said thank you for reading and till next time, I guess.


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iNubz
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PostSubject: Re: The importance of "Soul Taker" and missing the timing.   Sun Jul 15, 2012 4:30 pm

great article i think ima start using soul taker now...
also cant u use nurse reficule or simochi to make your opponent lose 1000 instead of gaining?


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L.Lawliet
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PostSubject: Re: The importance of "Soul Taker" and missing the timing.   Sun Jul 15, 2012 5:12 pm

iNubz wrote:
great article i think ima start using soul taker now...
also cant u use nurse reficule or simochi to make your opponent lose 1000 instead of gaining?

Yes, you can. It works good with both.


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The Crocodile
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PostSubject: Re: The importance of "Soul Taker" and missing the timing.   Sun Jul 15, 2012 5:34 pm

pancake wrote:
"If your opponent were to summon a copy of Elemental Hero The Shining while you had Mystical Space Typhoon and Torrential Tribute set you are in a position to not only destroy a backrow and The Shining, you can stop the opponent from returning two Elemental Heroes! If you were to activate Mystical Space Typhoon on a backrow and respond with Torrential Tribute the chain would resolve in such a manner that The Shining would be destroyed by Torrential Tribute but miss the opportunity to activate because Mystical Space Typhoon must resolve. The same would apply to Lightpulsar Dragon!"

Torrential tribute effect:
When a monster(s) is Summoned: Destroy all monsters on the field.

It says when a monster is summoned, what i worry about is when you activate MST as a response to a summon, can you chain TT to that and does TT miss the timing to be chained since you chain it to MST and last thing that happened is actually response with MST on summon and not the summon itself?






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L.Lawliet
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PostSubject: Re: The importance of "Soul Taker" and missing the timing.   Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:14 pm

The Crocodile wrote:
pancake wrote:
"If your opponent were to summon a copy of Elemental Hero The Shining while you had Mystical Space Typhoon and Torrential Tribute set you are in a position to not only destroy a backrow and The Shining, you can stop the opponent from returning two Elemental Heroes! If you were to activate Mystical Space Typhoon on a backrow and respond with Torrential Tribute the chain would resolve in such a manner that The Shining would be destroyed by Torrential Tribute but miss the opportunity to activate because Mystical Space Typhoon must resolve. The same would apply to Lightpulsar Dragon!"

Torrential tribute effect:
When a monster(s) is Summoned: Destroy all monsters on the field.

It says when a monster is summoned, what i worry about is when you activate MST as a response to a summon, can you chain TT to that and does TT miss the timing to be chained since you chain it to MST and last thing that happened is actually response with MST on summon and not the summon itself?

Pancake wrote ^^

Well the responding to to summoning and attacks aren't the same as responding to other cards. Say you can can't Magic Jammer at Chain Link 3 against the Monster Reborn in Chain Link 1.
In the summoning/attacking responds doesn't work like that. As long as it's a Summon or Attack response chain, you can use all the relevant effects as much as you want in any order in that chain.
Like for an example - After a Summon, you can chain 1 Torrential Tribute, they can chain 2 Trap Stun and you can still play a second copy of Torrential Tribute as chain 3 and resolve it's effect. That said, you can replace "Summon" with "Attack", and the 2 TT's with 2 Magic Cylinders in the last sentence and things would work fine as well.



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iNubz
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PostSubject: Re: The importance of "Soul Taker" and missing the timing.   Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:16 pm

and now im lost....


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L.Lawliet
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PostSubject: Re: The importance of "Soul Taker" and missing the timing.   Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:17 pm

iNubz wrote:
and now im lost....

His question was about the building of chains, like how should you build your chain so that the optional effect monster could miss it's timing. That's all.


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The Crocodile
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PostSubject: Re: The importance of "Soul Taker" and missing the timing.   Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:18 pm

didnt know that to be honest, i really thought those were 2 same things, thnx
nice article






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